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WelcomeEdit

Hi, welcome to TYPE-MOON Wiki! Thanks for your edit to the Arcueid (Fate/Extra) page.

Please leave a message on my talk page if I can help with anything! -- Azaghal (Talk) 20:26, July 25, 2010

Administration NominationEdit

Due to the lack of an active administrator, Arrancar109 has set up Forum:Administration Nomination. EGGS 15:33, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

Western naming orderEdit

I'd like to switch the character names over to Western order. See Forum:Western order. EGGS 17:24, March 3, 2012 (UTC)



Thanks for your corrections in my editions, I was very distracted with the prints of the conversation between Shiki R and Shiki T while I was with headache, then I've ended up writing SHIKI unconsciously. And thanks again about Crimson Moon, it looks better now! Eiyuu.ou (talk) 02:36, July 16, 2012 (UTC)

Glad to be of help. I agree, having two unrelated Shikis in the same scene might be a bit confusing. Sorry if I came off any bit rude in my edit responses.--Otherarrow (talk) 02:39, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
Aw, relax about! Eiyuu.ou 15:15, July 16, 2012 (UTC)

Japanese Information of Type-Moon WikiEdit

Link to information about the characters and series of Type-Moon in Japan:

Type-Moon JP: http://hiki.cre.jp/typemoon/

You will need someone to translate the information into English, my friend.

If I find someone, I will be sure to point them in that direction. In the meantime, you should step back for a moment. How can I trust you to translate Japanese when you can barely write English? EDIT:Of course, if English isn't your first language, I apologize, but you need to at least attempt to write so that people can understand you, as this is an English wiki. Maybe get someone to proofread for you? Again, sorry.--Otherarrow (talk) 01:39, November 14, 2012 (UTC)
I'm from Brazil and my native language is Portuguese Brazilian. It's hard to even write in English...
In that case, I am sorry if I insulted you. But reading over your edits and trying to get what you are saying is hard for me. (For example, in the Magical Amber edit, like I said, from what I've read, you were saying that the Kohaku alter ego is the Rin alter ego, and Zelretch and I think there was mention of her being TATARI too? I was confused! It seemed like nonsense!) I appreciate your contributions, but yeah, there are problems with understanding what you are saying and I am not the only one to bring it up with you. I am sorry, I don't mean to insult. I just want to help.--Otherarrow (talk) 01:54, November 14, 2012 (UTC)
Site where I find the information of Kaleidostick Ruby and Magical Amber: http://hiki.cre.jp/typemoon/?MagicalRuby
If we can find someone who can translate for us, we can make sense of it and put it on the page. Thanks.--Otherarrow (talk) 02:11, November 14, 2012 (UTC)

Videos with Story Modes of characters of MBAA translated into EnglishEdit

Sion Eltnam Altasia

Story-Mode: [LINK REMOVED]

Quotes: [LINK REMOVED]

Riesbyfe Stridberg

Story-mode:[LINK REMOVED]

Quotes: [LINK REMOVED]

Shiki Nanaya

Story-Mode: [LINK REMOVED]

Quotes: [LINK REMOVED]



Shiki Ryougi

Story-Mode: [LINK REMOVED]

Quotes: [LINK REMOVED]



With this, I hope it can help you work better in the parts of the characters' personalities and also in part roles.

Who are you and why did you just post links to a bunch of videos on my talk page? Sign your posts with --~~~~ please.--Otherarrow (talk) 01:25, November 26, 2012 (UTC)

I'm so sorry about my bad grammar but I also try my best to help.so please forgive me TT

and thank you so much to correct what I'm wrong.Thanks for such worthless person like me

Well, if you notice it, it's a start. Don't worry about it. You are not worthless. Unlike certain others I've had to deal with, I was actually able to make out what you were saying. Also, sign your posts with --~~~~ please.--Otherarrow (talk) 15:07, April 19, 2013 (UTC)


Teehee.thx There's something I want to know why we don't put nanaya sprites in profile.Like arcueid,akiha and sion

Oh,I never notice that you are the one who upload MBAA Eng which I always watch.You are doing with a great job!

I'm looking forward your another character translation ^^Hellslasher (talk) 00:09, April 20, 2013 (UTC)

Well, my problem with the Nanaya art is that there is way too much empty space. It makes the character template double in size when that option is chosen and it's pretty noticeable.
I think you have me confused with someone else. The only Melty Blood I have ever done is that I played the Web Trial for Act Cadenza and became disappointed that the only fighters were Len and White Len. My name is Otherarrow. I don't go by anything else. Is this about the video links that were posted here? Some anonymous guys posted them here and left before I can ask him what the hell that was about.--Otherarrow (talk) 02:34, April 20, 2013 (UTC)


Isee. So that's a reason why...I hope we could be friend.If there's anything I can help I will help as much as I can--Hellslasher (talk) 03:47, April 20, 2013 (UTC)

All help is appreciated.--Otherarrow (talk) 04:20, April 20, 2013 (UTC)


Othararrow help me plz! I have upload a few more tohno shiki's pic so I want to ask that my idea is okay or not?

If It's okay plz edit backgroundcolor in shiki's utilize move (because I don't have such skill)

sorry to disturb ya.--Hellslasher (talk) 04:00, April 23, 2013 (UTC)

I don't know what you mean.--Otherarrow (talk) 04:27, April 23, 2013 (UTC)


s-so sorry! I mean Shiki's utilized background color.It's a black color  so I need it to be edit so It will  be like in Character's Profile sorry! If It's still not be able to understand--Hellslasher (talk) 05:10, April 23, 2013 (UTC)

I don't know what to do about that. Also, why are you putting your signature on top of your post? It goes at the end.--Otherarrow (talk) 15:20, April 23, 2013 (UTC)

Well, in MB Actress Again Current Code Archetype: Earth doesn't say anything about her being Crimson Moon (at least, not directly). But as we already know, every True Ancestor has a Crimson Moon "persona" in them. Archetype just manifested that personality in Arcueid and nothing more, although Arcueid's persona it's the original and the other just a remnant of Crimson Moon manifested in her.

She says that she can change the world to how it was before mankind appeared, with Real of the World (or something like that), but without giving more details about it. That sounds logic because CM wanted a new world (kingdom) for himself. --RikuNoctis (talk) 12:02, May 8, 2013 (UTC)

From what I can gather from both Arc's and CM's pages, Archetype:Earth is the bit of CM inside of Arc, who is both "CM but not CM" and "Arcueid but not Arcueid". As a fragment of CM, she wishes for Arc to stop being Arc so she can take control and be reborn as CM and sort of "automatically" follows CM's will, but as an aspect of Arc, she wants Arc to keep being Arc, and ultimately wants the same thing Arc wants, even if it contradicts what CM wants. It's confusing, but in a weird sort of way, it makes vague sorts of sense to me.--Otherarrow (talk) 12:24, May 8, 2013 (UTC)

MeremEdit

Does it still look strange to you? It looked fine on my screen before, but I guess it could have been screwy on a different resolution. EGGS (talk) 10:53, September 15, 2013 (UTC)

Oh, it looks much better now. Thanks. I think the problem is both resolution and that we use different skins? I use Monobook.--Otherarrow (talk) 16:22, September 15, 2013 (UTC)

Servant Assassin Rule Edit

The Rule that every Assassin must be Hassan. I've begun to doubt it, due to Apocrypha. And no, it being an Alternate Universe is irrelevant, due to the fact it's the same Grail from Fuyuki. =/ The fact Jack the Ripper is not thought of to be a faulty Assassin Class is proof the rule can be bent without alternative factors, I.E., a Servant summoning another Servant. Simply put, I honestly doubt the "Must Be Hassan" rule holds any meaning whatsoever. Zahadrin (talk) 08:10, September 22, 2013 (UTC)

Oh, I agree. I always found it to be an arbitrary and pointless rule anyway, I mean, after all, Nasu tries to circumvent it in FSN itself. I guess it doesn't help that the way the Hassan are depicted in Fate is kinda eh.--Otherarrow (talk) 11:06, September 22, 2013 (UTC)

Look carefully at ALL premises, Apocrypha is after 3rd war, where Angra Mainyu tainted the Grail. Many rules were distorted since the corruption, including the Hassan rule. Having villains and fabricated individuals taking the place of anti-hero Hassan shows you how distorted the system had become.--Waifu slayer (talk) 13:46, September 22, 2013 (UTC)

That is indeed possible, but canon never states that as the reason the rule was circumvented or even implies it. As for the rule itself, remember that Kojiro is a "fake Assassin" who was summoned via loop hole, presumably due to his wraith status being similar to the Hassans, and while the setting itself doesn't explain Semiramis and Jack, Kairi at least questions if Semiramis is a Hassan when he first meets her. No reason is ever given for why the rule is ignored in F/A, aside from the out of universe "the 'only Hassan' rule is dumb and limiting".--Otherarrow (talk) 14:33, September 22, 2013 (UTC)
The Apocrypha draft had Sagara somehow circumventing the rule to specifically get a non-Hassan, so it is possible Darnic simply altered the rules in the novel version. It may be elaborated upon if there is a flashback to an altered summoning scene for Jack in the novels. EGGS (talk) 14:53, September 22, 2013 (UTC)
"Rule is dumb and limiting"? You are reading someone else's creation, their rules are the rules. The "only Hassans can be Assassins" rule had appeared several times in different books. I don't understand your beef with it at all. There is no sign of retcon, plus, there are NUMEROUS possible explanation for the apparent rule violations. It's like raging about "WHY SABRE IS NOT WEARING A THONG UNDER THAT BATTLE DRESS?! I DEMAND IT, PANTS ARE TOO LIMITING."Waifu slayer (talk) 16:00, September 22, 2013 (UTC)
I wasn't speaking from my own opinion (but it is one I happen to share), but I do think it kinda says something when every work aside from Fate/Zero tries to circumvent it, including the original work. It was more of an observation is all, and you don't need to get all uppity about it. Also, keep your Saber thong daydreams to yourself. I get that you are a perv who wants Saber to wear a thong under her dress, but that would be completely out of character for her IMO, so stop shouting about it.--Otherarrow (talk) 16:23, September 22, 2013 (UTC)
If you read Nasu's works, his story telling is all about establishing rules to build tension, and then breaking them one by one for dramatic purposes. Let's see some cases:
1. True Ancestors being all powerful? A human can kill one. 
2. Phantasmal beasts being powerful and immune to everything modern day? A boy killed one bare-handed. 
3. Servants being superhuman? Multiple humans indeed crossed swords with Servants and lived. 
Nasu is all about "circumventing rules". Would you even read any of this stuff if everything is by the rules?Waifu slayer (talk) 16:30, September 22, 2013 (UTC)
...So basically, you are agreeing with me, the "Hassan is Assassin" rule is not rigid and absolute and stupid rules can be circumvented and ignored. Yet, before, you were all "NO! HASSAN IS ASSASSIN AND THAT IS THE WAY IT SHOULD BE!". Pick one. Either the rules can be broken or they can't. Also, you picked some rather bad examples. True Ancestors can be killed by a human...if the human has magic eyes that can kill anything (and even then, the True Ancestor didn't actually die. I've speculated that she could be killed with the Eyes but that is just that, speculation). So first point is out. Phantasmal beasts being super powerful and immune to everything modern day. A boy killing one bare handed doesn't really count as "modern day" does it? Folks have been killing shit with their bare hands since the race began. The boy being able to kill one is an impressive feat, but it isn't really a rule circumvention. Now, if he did it with a gun or something, with the handwave that the bullets were made from stones from the pyramids, then that would be one. Either way, the second point is out. Servants being superhumans is indeed one, but Servants aren't automatically better than humans solely because they are Servants. They are superhumans because they were superhuman in life, but they also have weaknesses that witty humans can exploit. But yes, while your logic behind it (from what I can gather) is shaky, point three is correct. Servants are, by their nature as legends of old, better than humans, but humans can fight, survive, and in some cases even win under the right conditions and against the right Servant. ...Why are we arguing? It seems that we have the same point, you are just bad at explaining it, or in a mood for a discussion so you forced one out of nowhere. Either way, I apologize if it indeed was something from my end as well.--Otherarrow (talk) 16:43, September 22, 2013 (UTC)
Wat. "Pick one"? There are no rigid rules in Type Moon. The story telling is based on breaking and bending rules. Let's see some Grail War rules. 
1. The Grail summons the Servant. Broken by Einzberns, who brute forced it with Ilya and stolen mana from the Grail. 
2. There are no repeat Servants. Broken by Edelfelts, with two Sabres. To an extend, the Fifth war, with two Assassins. 
3. Contracts are formed with the Master, and then the leyline links the Master and Servant. Broken by Kayneth, with Sola. 
There's more and more. If you get tripped up by Nasuverse rules, you are gonna have a bad time. Waifu slayer (talk) 16:55, September 22, 2013 (UTC)
PREDIT:I'll give you a freebee on the rule circumvention thing, as your first set of examples were pretty bad (the second set was a great improvement and I have nothing to contest): It is established that Ultimate Ones don't have the Earthly concept of death and can only be killed by Conceptual Weapons that forces it on them....except three of them were killed without a Conceptual Weapon anyway, simply because the person killing them was that powerful (and probably some other stuff we have yet to hear, but Nasu loves overcomplicating stuff). I guess this is what you meant by the boy and the Phantasmal Beast, that supposed immunities can be circumvented if the attack is strong enough. Again, you weren't very clear on that one.
You are flip flopping dude. You argued before that the rules are absolute and if I think a rule is "dumb", I can go stuff it (of course, that comment was probably also a "no one can have opinions ever" dealo, but whatever), but now you are trying to argue that the rules are not absolute and can be bended and broken. Which is exactly what I was saying. You are confusing me because you are changing which side you are on in this argument. But since we are in complete agreement now, I will end this before you change your mind again. Oh, and a note for the Waifood of five minutes ago (since you seem to swap opinions constantly or something): The rules of the Nasuverse are flexable. If you get tripped up by them, you are gonna have a bad time. EDIT: That crack was probably offensive to folks with split personalities, and I do apologize. I mean most of my dumb wisecracks in good nature, and I felt that may have crossed the line.--Otherarrow (talk) 17:04, September 22, 2013 (UTC)

Future GospelEdit

The confusion might stem from the fact that the novel and manga portions were translated and released at different times by different people. Here's the index. Later releases also just included the novel portions. EGGS (talk) 17:09, November 2, 2013 (UTC)

Really? Weird. I still don't feel comfortable with labeling stuff from the manga extras as Future Gospel, since Future Gospel is the particular story, and these seem to be unrelated pieces. I have no idea what else to call it though.--Otherarrow (talk) 18:09, November 2, 2013 (UTC)

There is something I want to ask about Lancer(CCC)'s parameter

in-game her stat is

  • Strength: C
  • Endurance: D
  • Agility: E
  • Mana: A
  • Luck: B

while in Fate/Extra material is 

  • Strength: C
  • Endurance: D
  • Agility: A
  • Mana: E
  • Luck: B

Which one is correct exactly? Hellslasher (talk) 09:24, January 29, 2014 (UTC)

She has two different classes and has cycled through multiple Masters, so remember that. It's very possible that both are correct. But honestly...I don't know. This wouldn't be the first time the Extra Material has contradicted the actual game.--Otherarrow (talk) 15:07, January 29, 2014 (UTC)
If you go through EXTRA Material, there are MANY discordances. It is likely that the EXTRA Material content was the original intended content, but due to various reasons (time, game/hardware constraints), many things were cut or modified. This is particularly apparent when you read through the dictionaries. 
Both are legitimate, in my opinion. Waifu slayer (talk) 19:58, January 29, 2014 (UTC)
There are contents in there that are clearly ideas that they had that were cut for time/written out (for example, there was a lot more about Savior, more Alter-Egos, etc), but then there are things that are changed for what seems like no discernible reason. Both Lancer and Red Lancer have slightly different stats, Anderson has a different alignment, etc. I don't think we can chalk those up to just "changed because of time or game constraints", as those aren't really things that would be affected by that (as far as I can tell). But yes, both are official...but which is "more official" is a matter of debate. In cases where they contradict, we should probably just note both and comment that one set comes from the EXTRA Material.--Otherarrow (talk) 20:39, January 29, 2014 (UTC)

WorldsEdit

There are DAs in all worlds, but only some worlds have DAA as a grouping. In the most recent case files, Wallachia stayed Zepia and Blackmore died a long time ago. Neither was ever a DAA. That's why I made those world tags, for when there is no point in splitting an article out into two versions, but each worldline has a different background for a character. EGGS (talk) 21:23, August 25, 2017 (UTC)

That's not what the page on parallel worlds says, (it basically says Dead Apostles and Heroic Spirits are mutually exclusive for...some reason?) but sure. Regardless of lore, I feel that template and its siblings aren't very intuitive; I had no idea what the templates were referring to and it seems like just a random listing of different worlds put in a seemingly random section. Maybe instead a more general template explaining that the information in a section isn't canon to the "main" Tsukihime continuities and not worry about readers knowing about weird retcons explained only in supplementary materials.
Also, the Blackmore referenced in Case Files could possibly be the guy who the Blackmore we know stole the name from, not the one who currently uses the name. The bird Blackmore explicitly had another "true name" and only became "Gransurg Blackmore" later on.--Otherarrow (talk) 21:33, August 25, 2017 (UTC)
Yeah, the pages really aren't fully up to date with the new lore. Basically, all characters who exist as DAs will exist in all worlds (most likely) but the Fate Worlds lack the idea of DAAs as an organization and most have different histories, and Tsuki Worlds lack the idea of summoning Heroic Spirits. I think the templates themselves will be fine once the distinction is made. Then there is the third kind of mixed world like strange fake that has both DAAs and Heroic Spirits, so that's another can of worms. From what I can tell, most Japanese sites recognize that Blackmore as the main Blackmore, so I assume there are more indicators in the novel than just the name being referenced. EGGS (talk) 21:40, August 25, 2017 (UTC)
I think since most articles affected by this (the DAA themselves mainly) don't really go into multiversal stuff we need a quick and intuitive way to explain this stuff instead of hoping readers can understand a template that references an obscure retcon without any context or relying on said retcon becoming common knowledge; we should think about readers reading the wiki for information's sake, not ones who already know all the lore.
Also, vampire lore seems to necessitate that the Blackmore buried can't be the birdman as the birdman was a vampire before he was Gransurg Blackmore; vampires don't leave a corpse when they die, so how can he be buried? It's likely that the Japanese sites reporting on it just took the reference at face value or even forgot that he stole the name (he's a pretty obscure character). Regardless, I think the best way to go about it is to note that a Gransurg Blackmore is dead in Case Files and is buried at the Blackmore Graveyard but not definitively state it's the birdman or the original until we get definite proof it's definitely the birdman or even elaborated on in any way (I somehow doubt it is, but I want to know for sure.)--Otherarrow (talk) 22:00, August 25, 2017 (UTC)
Fate worlds definitely have Dead Apostles. Zepia is a DA in Case Files. Also it's the same Gransurg Blackmore as Zepia says that he would have been a comrade of Gransurg Blackmore in a group of more than twenty people in another world. Also the worlds branched 1700 years ago, according to Zepia. In Case Files we also have the Forest of Einnashe being a thing, and the same goes for Rita. Yokushi (talk) 22:09, August 25, 2017 (UTC)
This whole world split thing is apparently an important plot point regarding why strange fake is a mix of worlds, so I think it's going to be even more prevalent from here. I certainly have no qualms about making the wording of such templates easier to understand, but I think the underlying lore behind it will be important to note in the future. EGGS (talk) 22:31, August 25, 2017 (UTC)
That's fair, I was unaware strange fake being a mixed world was a plot point and not just an excuse to explain why there is a vampire there. But yes, clearer phrasing should be done regardless. The idea I came up with to fix the templates, at least for now, without being too vague (as they are now) or too in depth is to have them say "the following section takes place in a Fate World (with link to the Parallel Worlds page), and thus is not in continuity with the events of Tsukihime" or the like, and then have an equivalent template in the off chance a Tsukihime character shows up in Fate (such as...Shiki Ryougi? Is Kara no Kyoukai a Fate world or a Tsukihime world?).
The Blackmore who Birdman killed to take the name was also a DAA so that doesn't specify it being specifically Birdman, does he elaborate on him beyond that? I guess it's impossible to prove and doesn't matter though. I am curious as to how Zepia knows of this however, but that's irrelevant to the current topic.--Otherarrow (talk) 22:42, August 25, 2017 (UTC)
Kara no Kyoukai and Tsukihime can't exist at the same time, so it's probably closer to Fate. And I assume Zepia probably knows all of that thanks to TRI-HERMES, Atlas' spiritron computer, as here Zepia still is the Director of Atlas. He also uses one of the Atlas nine weapons, Logos Re:Act, that apparentyly works like Chaldea's TRISMEGISTUS and can layshift people into the past. I also forgot to say that in the Afterword, Nasu directly says that yeah, the individuals that form the 27 Dead Apostle Ancestors exist in Fate, they just aren't the 27 Dead Apostle Ancestors. Like what we saw with Roa in the Count of Monte Cristo Drama CD. Yokushi (talk) 22:51, August 25, 2017 (UTC)
That's fair, I think the pre-Tsukihime stuff in particular will be hard to place definitively in Fate or Tsukihime worlds and probably won't be in canon materals unless Nasu does a QA and someone thinks to ask (it doesn't help that Mahoyo at least seems to be in continuity with both). Thank you for clarifying further!--Otherarrow (talk) 23:05, August 25, 2017 (UTC)

"Plagiarism" Edit

Hey there. So you accused me of plagiarizing someone's work, which is fine. That's cool. But I don't appreciate the double standards you are upholding when you aren't revising such instances on every single other character profile that has been updated with recently released translations. I appreciate if you do so promptly next time if you want to improve the wiki on the "plagiarism" matter.

Also, these updates aren't even my own work. They are clearly cited and I used the translation's exact wordings because I trust the translator's work when he/she reads the Japanese text and translate it to English as such (heck, I don't even cite myself when translating my works here in the wiki). I'm not sure where you are getting the idea of me plagiarizing works when they aren't to my own benefit and are clearly someone else's work and is easily identified in the references. Whether it is my pasting or your paraphrasing, both are equally seen as plagiarism if the reference isn't there.

Thank you for reading.

N/A 03:03, December 24, 2017 (UTC)Clyton

I admit that plagiarism was probably the wrong term, but I do think it's...improper for a wiki to be just flat out copying the things it is referencing instead of, well, referencing it. It comes off as sloppy and lazy to the outside reader, I feel (even if it actually isn't!) As for other cases, I probably just haven't noticed it, I'm only a single editor and I happened to check the article by chance.
But yes, I think as a wiki, we should be aiming towards "paraphrase, with cited reference" instead of just copying the contents of the profiles flat out. A lot of the GO profiles, especially for gag or event characters like Altera the Santa, are written in ways that doesn't translate to the articles smoothly (They tend to include casual language, aside references and jokes, and other things that contrast the encyclopedic tone the wiki has; Altera the Santa's profile in particular seems to be written like a storybook) I am not good at getting my point across, but I hope I am being clear? Again, apologizes for any trouble.
EDIT: Of course, the idea just occurred to me that we could post the profiles, for GO, EXTRA, Extella, etc, somewhere in the article (like a specific "Profiles" section or the like?), original translations credited and cited of course, and then paraphrase in the article text? I've seen other wikis do similar things (for example, the Touhou Wiki posts every character profile a given character has in a closed tab in a designated section at the end of each character article) --Otherarrow (talk) 03:29, December 24, 2017 (UTC)
     Not everything can be translated to the traditional wiki format, and TM wiki has never been that traditional in my opinion. That is because the Nasuverse is filled with stories with a heavy story-telling format that enables multiple possibilities of story layouts, endings, etc. So what if Altera Santa's profile is a joke and full of references and not encyclopedic? You can see subtle jokes and references in even the most "non-joke" characters and their abiltiies and personalities. That's just how the TM writers are and that's their cultural style of writing. When you read one character's profile, you see that there's a story to them. It's never truly encyclopedic (you might as well just go to Wikipedia and check out the Heroic Spirits' identities and read those profiles, those are encyclopedic; meanwhile, you have fictional characters of these same figures of our real life translated into a story format with creative liberties done to them) and I even had to hammer the point home to editors here that when I was translating the FGO Servants' background, they are meant to be done in a storytelling tone. When I read it, I felt engaged because I was interested in what the TM writers have for these figures of our own world, and I translated to preserve that tone. I love Caesar's background for example; it's not encyclopedic despite being in a really important section called "the character's history" and it's a creative way of telling something everyone already knows about just by reading Caesar on Wikipedia.
    So even if I'm vilified just because I'm pasting someone's work that is being referenced (and I can take the extra step and mention that the authors were asked beforehand if this can be used) while it is seen as plagarism, so be it. I rather preserve the TM authors and how they wrote that profile, and I would preserve the translator's outlook on those Japanese text and how they translated that with particular English words, and put them here, on the wiki, of which a lot of people check since common people knows that the wiki is a database collecting works from far and wide into a place accessible and recognizable. They would see an article, see the translated structure of it, refer to the translator and the author and the text of English and Japanese, and see how this character is understood in English. I would disagree with people paraphrasing texts or trying to put it into more formal English while removing key context (like the Grammar Guy editor) because not only do these edits usually remove the storytelling tone, it also removes information that everyone should know once that work was translated.
     Removing the joking parts and the references to pop/modern culture part is less of a sin to me than the removal of information, but it's still something I don't condone because it removes the author's inspiration for this. No one would then know that Fate was inspired by Makai Tensho, or that particular Servants were inspired by the corresponding figure used in other anime and manga. For example, let's take Candy Star Photon Ray. I don't know that the relationship between that NP and Circe's NP will be told in a future episode, so I can't look forward to it, nor can I reference it once the episode does come out. I don't know that this NP has heavy influence from Itano Circus (when I first read it, it's the first I saw the term, but I checked out the meaning behind it and realized that it's a style of dogfighting used since Macross, and from thereon, I would know what constitutes an Itano Circus just by seeing specific animation patterns). I don't know that, assuming I was in Altera's perspective, that this NP animation would be the very same thing of what she dreamt of, of sheeps flying throughout the sky like a rainbow. The last part, it's very beautiful and adds depth to how I can look at Altera overall when considering FGO and Extella, of how I can look at her girly side in a different light. All of that is gone with this encyclopedic version at first glance.
     My plead is that you first see the first steps being made on the wiki. The reason I'm pasting is simple. It retains all information (although that truly depends on the translator's work and if he/she missed anything or misintrepreted anything wrong, and there are chances where this happened and I changed some articles here and there on that info despite the encyclopedic profiles haven't been edited to reflect that) and it retains the storytelling tone. Most importantly, I can reference it to somewhere. Because as it is, TM wiki has some inaccuracies in regards to some articles. To nip it in the bud, any new changes or revealed information would be pasted first. I would then look it over and edit some of its sentences and grammar errors (if any) while retaining its information. After all of that is done, move all of that into the encyclopedic templates within TM wiki. Then, we can start paraphrasing it. Because by that point, readers and editors will see that this is all the information available to them, and if they read the paraphrased versions afterward, they can see if there were any changes that omited or added context that wasn't there.
     You can check my talk page for my goals. It's a long method, but it will bear fruit in the future. Translate everything and reveal all information, jokes, references, etc. into English. Take into account all sources. And only after everything is translated while adhering to what the TM authors have wrote, move it into the TM wiki's encyclopedic templates while paraphrasing the translated information. Finally then can the wiki be at the standard. That everything is sourced, that any reader can trace back to who translated it, that they can trace back to the original text, and hopefully see that everything is accurate and all stones are overturned.
N/A 04:50, December 24, 2017 (UTC)Clyton
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